Suzuki V-Strom (VStrom) Owners Club DL250, DL650, DL1000 & DL1050
Preferred Suppliers => Sharealike Clutch Modifications => Preferred Suppliers => Owner Q&A => Topic started by: sharealike on November 05, 2009, 22:39:07
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Hi All
I have run two SV1000 nakeds over the last five years and become aware of clutch basket damper issues that cause vibration under load and various noises at idle and just above. Suzuki deny there is any issue on SV's but I know and have proven different, but they do say early DL's had issues that are now resolved. Changes of baskets for new on DL's or putting SV complete clutches in seems to reduce things for a while but it returns too soon for the three or four hundred pounds it costs. US and Australian forums confirm this is even more of a problem on DL1000's than the SV's.
I have now proved that some involved reworking of the damper in the basket cures the vibration. I made an offer to modify baskets for a few people here in the UK that had the same vibration problem. I offered this free of charge (now over) to people with the ability to swap their baskets themselves and become test guinea pigs. I modified baskets for people with the engine vibration problem all over the world in the end, as no one from the UK came forward. Now modified over close to 200 (September 2011) and looking to continue getting rid of this vibration that spoils our otherwise beautiful engines.
PM me if you wish to know more. Email directly at vibfreevstrom@yahoo.com
Sharealike aka John
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Damn I live in Yorkshire but I have a K2
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Double Dam I'm a Yorkshire K2 owner too !!!
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Dogpuf, Bob
Lets not rule you out just yet as you will be on my doorstep.
I understand the springs fail in many K2 baskets so should in theory not be as repairable as the later baskets. that's why the ideal trialists would not be K2's. Their damper springs can squash and get tired so lose their effectiveness and have been known to twist through the windows in the keeper plate. The windows were very large so broken bits of spring could get out with the risk of them locking the clutch plates together or holding them appart. Later versions had smaller windows but Suzuki missed two other problems that crop up on every basket made for these big V Twins.
If you have a vibration problem that starts from about 3,000 rpm and upwards under slight to full engine load and may also have a tock, tock noise at idle with a clatter as you go from drive to overun at 1,500 to 2,500 rpm, then it could be that the modification I propose will reduce and/or eliminate much or all of these.
If you have these issues I think you will probably have looked at your basket or perhaps have this in mind to do already. If you are going to have a basket out then give me a shout to have quick look or a chat through just what you found. This before you decide on spending £300 plus on a replacement, or put it back with a view to suffering in silence (well perhaps more in rattle and vibe). If repairable I can sort it out in a day or so. Yes - FREE in the spirit of proving what's wrong and then I might start up repairing these on a maintenace exchange arrangement. The whole basket damper will feel very loose and you can think the springs are shot but in fact the problem is in the quality of the assembly that causes them to set out on the route to self destruct. You can catch them and halt this with a few clever modifications. The position of the individual springs is most important as is the location and relationship of the inner and outer keeper plates to each other.
Could be a few reasons why you don't have the original K2 basket still in the bike. I hear dealers changed these out for later designs as soon as there was any suggestion of a problem within the warranty and perhaps a little beyond. A previous owner might have changed the basket if you bought your bikes second hand.
Sharealike
Edit Nov 8th 2010. K2 springs are proving to to be fine and not having the problems once suspected. Free trial is well past and now modify baskets for owners in all countries. New baskets start with the same problems by 10,000 miles or even less. Even those manufactured in 2009!!!
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To member SHAREALIKE, I have a vstrom 1000 and the clutch is really noisy at tickover, when you pull the clutch lever in it quietens it considerably, Having read your thread regarding clutch basket damper modifiation I was wondering if this is the sort of problem you can assist with? (it really is driving me mad!!) I live near Wakefield in Yorkshire and probably going to be messing with the clutch some time next month before I get the bike out for good. Hope to here from you . steve
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sfarrar
Very glad to help you. This issue is well known in some parts of the world. You are the first person in the UK to respond.
I have repaired many of these dampers for people in France, USA, Australia and Germany over the last few months. This as part of the original free trial. They have this annoying knock at idle when the bike is hot and also a vibration under load at anything from 3,000 to 4,000 rpm.
Experience has now shown that early K2 baskets can be modified just as well as the later ones. Most K2 baskets were changed under warranty by Suzuki in the USA or just after by their owners. The replacements have not faired much better. Suzuki tell me production and so development of the engine has finished. There will not be a later basket for DL or SV.
Many people are on their second or third basket and find the problems start to show again after only 2,000 miles. They are buying used K2 and K3 bikes that develop the problem and find they have the later basket fitted when they take them down. K6 and K7 owners are also sending the clutch dampers for repair at about 15,000 miles.
Here in the UK we just don't seem to get the miles on the bikes like these bloke's do. From what I see in the 20 or so I have now stripped I would say all bikes are going to need a basket modification one day.
Three ways to sort this out.
1 - New baskets modified before fitting. Owners supply the basket or I source the part in the UK. Modified basket posted back.
2 - People remove their baskets and post to me for repair and modification. Returned by post after.
3 - People find a used basket or an old one they took out some time back. Repaired and modified with return by post.
I will PM you with my contact details and we can take it from there. We live very close so I can even help you with the stripdown if required. There are a few good presentations around showing DL owners how to get the clutch out. First thing is to make very certain it is a knock due to the clutch basket damper. There is a test for this.
Sharealike
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My 2003 DL1000 has this clutch problem too. I have just been living with it because as you say a new basket can only last 2000 miles. If I can help please let me know. Paul.
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Blackbeard
I can repair your existing clutch basket for you. Are you able to strip it out of the bike yourself and post to me.
Oil pump drive gear can be left on for me to remove if you send your existing by post.
PM me or respond here if you wish to take this further.
Sharealike
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sfarrar and blackbeard
Sent you both a PM each on this but no response so far. Please could you respond with still interested or otherwise.
Kind regards
Sharealike
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Hello sharealike.
I had a DL1000 K2 for a while and suffered the clutch basket vibration -- our US friends on their 'StromTrooper' forum call it "chudder".
I bought an 18 months old (1900 miles on the clock) K3 model 5 years ago to replace the K2, and was disappointed that there was still clutch basket vibration. I wrote to Suzuki-GB quoting the K3's VIN No., and they confirmed that the bike had been fitted on the assembly line with the old-type (K2 & early K3) clutch basket.
At 6845 miles, I bought & fitted a genuine Suzuki new-type clutch basket, and the engine was so much smoother.
However, at 18900 miles, I have become aware that the old vibration may be there again.
I would mention that the majority of the (12K) miles covered have been 2-up with 3 full luggage boxes!
I could be interested in your clutch basket modification -- I also still have the (K2 & early K3) OEM basket that I removed from the bike some 3 years ago.
Regards, ejayaitch.
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Hi
Sv1000s K3 in Bradford, with major clutch rattle. Would be really grateful for anyone who can sort it for me. It drives me mental
DAve
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Bandit401962
The standard baskets can be loud at idle once the newness has worn off. Much of the noise is down to the basket having lost its damping at idle which the modification does address.
Main tell tale of this is as you ride. Have you a shudder or vibration as you ride through 3 to 4 k rpm. It's a band about 500 rpm wide and there in all gears and throttle openings. Owners tend to find themselves riding round this area without realising, yet it's quite a sweet spot of the engine when they are right.
Another tell tale as you ride at low speeds such as in traffic is a clack, clack, clack as you go from drive to overun.
If you have the vibration there is a test that's a good indicator if the damper is past it's best. Find the rough area in the rpm range (usually 3300-3700) so you can consistently duplicate the vibration as you ride. You might find a long gradual uphill helps hold it in the zone. Once you've found it, now ride through it and as you do, pull in the clutch just a hair as you pass through the offending range and see what happens. Not enough to allow it to slip, but just about to.
If the shudder disappears, you likely have the infamous clutch shudder. If it does not disappear, there may be other issues, like throttle body synchronization, throttle position sensor adjustment or lean FI issues.
Vstrom owners seem more sensitive to it. Perhaps due to higher top gear ratio, torquey tune of the engine and they tend to like a more relaxed cruise. The clutch dampers are the same except the SV works the same parts even harder due to harder springs.
Owners of the early bikes I did are reporting that the modification is still good after 10,000 miles. Americans I did in the spring.
Sharealike.
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Bandit401962
The standard baskets can be loud at idle once the newness has worn off. Much of the noise is down to the basket having lost its damping at idle which the modification does address.
Main tell tale of this is as you ride. Have you a shudder or vibration as you ride through 3 to 4 k rpm. It's a band about 500 rpm wide and there in all gears and throttle openings. Owners tend to find themselves riding round this area without realising, yet it's quite a sweet spot of the engine when they are right.
Another tell tale as you ride at low speeds such as in traffic is a clack, clack, clack as you go from drive to overun.
If you have the vibration there is a test that's a good indicator if the damper is past it's best. Find the rough area in the rpm range (usually 3300-3700) so you can consistently duplicate the vibration as you ride. You might find a long gradual uphill helps hold it in the zone. Once you've found it, now ride through it and as you do, pull in the clutch just a hair as you pass through the offending range and see what happens. Not enough to allow it to slip, but just about to.
If the shudder disappears, you likely have the infamous clutch shudder. If it does not disappear, there may be other issues, like throttle body synchronization, throttle position sensor adjustment or lean FI issues.
Vstrom owners seem more sensitive to it. Perhaps due to higher top gear ratio, torquey tune of the engine and they tend to like a more relaxed cruise. The clutch dampers are the same except the SV works the same parts even harder due to harder springs.
Owners of the early bikes I did are reporting that the modification is still good after 10,000 miles. Americans I did in the spring.
Sharealike.
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Good thread here, sharealike, and very good of you to offer your expertise! :clap:
I'm in Buxton, Debyshire, with a 1000K6 GT with nearly 7k on the clock.
I can get down to 45 mph in OD on neutral throttle and accelerate very gently on it without drama but I've noticed more roughness from 4 1/2k ish upwards, any gear.
Not had the bike long (few weeks) and only just did the TB synch and fitted a TRE yesterday (no difference whatsoever with the TRE).
The TB sych was way out (160/225, 4 dealer stamped services and never touched/checked :angry-tappingfoot: ) but noticed one cylinder vacuum more unstable than the other.
I'll try some more checks before coming back to you in case it's not the clutch damping issue starting up, if the offer is still on...
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Hi, are you still offering this mod ? I've just bought a late 03 DL1000 but it turned out to be a k2 bike and between 3k and 4k there is a terrible noise and harshness, really bad.
Thanks, Steve
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Thank you for your interest. Yes I still do the modifications to the clutch baskets.
Plenty of 03 registered turn out to be the K2 build clutch. None the worse for it though.
The K2 was said to be alone in having the problem. Now well accepted that all years can get these harsh vibes. Only 20% of the seventy five Stroms I have done to date are K2. Even had to do them for the recent GT models between 10 and 20k miles. They all modify with the same good results.
Some owners even ring up to thank me profusely for the improvement its made. Still going strong after a long trip two up on holiday abroad.
A few in the USA put close to 10,000 miles on my modification in six months without problems. Some French and German owners are not far behind.
Plenty write saying its as if they just got a new bike and no longer trying to sell it.
I only went "open" offering the modification to all owners at the start of 2010. Not a business though. This was pull by them rather than push by me. Demand for what I do being driven by owners. Up till then the only treatment for a vibrating engine caused by the clutch was another basket from Suzuki that all too often would start to vibrate again.
Most owners manage to swap the basket themselves following a set of slides I send out. Plenty have their dealer do it and I can turn the baskets round real quick.
Away less than a week in the UK. Including post both ways and time here for the re-enginering modification.
Total time away is week and a few days for Europe if the owner is in a hurry and willing to pay for next day shipping both ways. Same for the USA and the rest of the world.
Outside the UK they are never away for more than three weeks using normal shipping rates and timescales.
Please give me a call or email directly and we can take it from there.
John
0777 077 2456
vibefreevstrom@yahoo.com
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had mine done around the Feb time and took the basket out myself with very little previous mechanical experience
solved my problems and I was very pleased with the results,
unfortunately I wrote my bike off a few weeks later but put it back on the road within two weeks and have done 4k since the mod again can say its still going great and with further advice found on the forums bike really is as sweet as a nut
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Thanks, will give you a ring.
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had mine done around the Feb time and took the basket out myself with very little previous mechanical experience
solved my problems and I was very pleased with the results,
unfortunately I wrote my bike off a few weeks later but put it back on the road within two weeks and have done 4k since the mod again can say its still going great and with further advice found on the forums bike really is as sweet as a nut
theshed
Glad to hear you managed to get her back on the road. Thank you for the mileage and progress update on the modified basket.
Sharealike - John
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John, you've saved me from selling the V-Strom :grin:
I've not gone very far, just round the block but the vibration is gone, 100% gone. It accelerates through 2, 3, 4 and 5k rpm without any vibration or rattle at all. Perfect !
Many thanks . . . and poor show for Suzuki not doing this in the first place !
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This ought to be a sticky thread like the manuals above. Can't imagine how people get on with a standard clutch basket.
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Steve
Thank you for the write up. Bit more information for those who might be delving into their own vibrations during the winter months.
This is why they vibrate - The centre hub in the basket wears. This is not the needle roller, but the alloy of the basket going loose on the gear. They can be like this with just 10,000 miles under their belts. Now close to a hundred DL, SV and KLV owners running this modification round the world.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OIvTi5elN_k
Its encouraged by the loose spring keeper plate that eats further into the alloy of the basket as the miles build. This is the inside of a brand new basket here for modification. That plate is not fastened in place at all. Spends its life hula-hooping about.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WSdfh8WU9P0
Stripped, Inspected and modified components return from machine shop. Ready to start final assembly.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/90341-1/IMGP7401.JPG)
New bush fitted where Suzuki leave alloy to run direct on steel hub.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/90355-1/IMGP7409.JPG)
Assembled and adjustments made for minimum vibration and maximum life.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/90351-1/IMGP7407.JPG)
Completed modification all torqued up and ready to return to owner.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/90353-1/IMGP7408.JPG)
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Hi
I've just purchased a 2007 Vee, I've done about 700 miles on it and have to say I have noticed the chudder at below 4000 revs. Would you say I have the clutch basket problem and if so do you still do the modifications. Thanks paul.
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Hi john my 06 100 vstrom has 9k on it and suffers from clutch rattle. How much does it cost to get the mod done?
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Send him a private message blokes ("PM" button under his name), he says to do that in the first post so he probably has his profile setup to send him email when someone sends him a PM :thumb:
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Hi john my 06 100 vstrom has 9k on it and suffers from clutch rattle. How much does it cost to get the mod done?
Hi
I've just purchased a 2007 Vee, I've done about 700 miles on it and have to say I have noticed the chudder at below 4000 revs. Would you say I have the clutch basket problem and if so do you still do the modifications. Thanks paul.
Thank you for your interest donny1972 and Bradders. I still perform the modifications to the DL and SV1000 clutch baskets. We can PM through this forum or email me direct on vibefreevstrom@yahoo.com to exchange info and diagnose. Email is quicker and less cumbersome because I only have time to visit the various forums every few days.
Need to be certain a bike has the "chudder" as you ride and eliminated other likely causes before getting into money and the engine. Most have tried everything else and there are a few tests you can make to confirm it's the basket needs the work. Seems all too often a new standard basket from Suzuki will only damp the problem short term once the bike has previously "chuddered". Options are to modify existing or modify a brand new direct from Suzuki. Everything sorted and a smooth bike within a week for UK owners. Typical is then two weeks for Europe, three for USA, South Africa, South America and Australia. Costs depend where you are. Based in West Yorkshire so drop off and collect in person is an option.
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Not that I mind at all but had a good few questions directly via email recently - so here we go with a few answers.
Some time since you updated the thread. Are you still doing the modifications to stop them vibrating? Yes.
How much are genuine new baskets? Recent price rises have put them over £350. Delivery will be extra. Vibration is very likely to return within 10,000 miles. :angry-tappingfoot:
How much is the modification and how long does it take? Post on Monday and they will be returned by Friday. Typical is owners take them out one weekend and get their vibration free bike back on the road by noon the following Saturday. Cost is at least £100 below new including the post both ways. :auto-dirtbike:
Geniune new modified for the UK work out at £545 delivered.
All the springs feel loose in the basket I just took off the bike? Yes they should be. Well all but one.
What parts do I need? A new gasket for certain. £10 or less id you use pattern. Water pump cover 'O' ring might come in handy if the bikes over five years old. £8 or so from Suzuki. Clutch holding tool if you don't have one. Top quality item is about £18 delivered from eBay. Usual tools oil and so forth that most DIY maintainers will have about. :fix:
Can I have my Suzuki dealership or independent workshop fit a modified basket? Yes. Many dealers and workshops remove baskets and store the bike for a few days while its away. I return the modifed basket direct to them for fitting within four working days of receiving it. Pay the workshop for labour and materials only. I don't know what they charge but two hours out and two hours to fit should be the maximum. :shrug:
My basket moves quite a bit on the gear. Is this OK?. It should move a bit, but after 5,000 miles or more it will probably have become too loose and the vibration is partly down to this. I can point you off to a few items on youtube showing how to check them over on the bench without stripping them down. Messy and that's my bit.
Baskets sent will be inspected free of charge. First class post is about £8 each way.
:ty:
Sharealike
vibefreevstrom@yahoo.com
0777 077 2456
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Just over two years now (MAY 2012) since owners first ride reports on the re-engineered clutch baskets started to come in.
April 2010 Owner in Northern California.
"I just got back from a trip with over 800 miles on the basket I recently received back from John (Sharealike) and installed in my 04 Vee with 20K miles. Having the crappy chudder/vibration gone is to me the best upgrade that has been done to this bike. It makes low speed riding very pleasant and running it up through the rpm range significantly smoother. John has been great to deal with and has answered all of my questions and did a fast turn around. His work looks very "factory" and it is great to have this long time problem on an otherwise great machine solved".
800 miles later
"I now have about 1600 miles on the modded basket I received from Sharealike and it continues to preform as when I installed it. No chudder and very smooth throught he range".
April 2010 Owner in Nebraska
"The bike was hideous, embarrassing, at idle but not after the basket mod. I hear that idle hammer is a different issue. I guess my problem was all chudder? The improvement in vibration isn’t just in the grievously affected 3K rpm zone but throughout.
A thousand thanks to Sharealike. The Vstrom community is indebted to you for your determination and your willingness to learn and evolve your solution based on that growing understanding. My hat is off to you, sir. Now, if only Suzuki would stop turning a blind eye.
A happy camper, I am".
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And more from April 2010 - Owner in Germany
"Yesterday my modified basket arrived back from John (Sharealike).
Today I reassembled my clutch and made a small test ride (15km)
At least 10km were done between 3000 and 4000 rpm.
First I must tell you that I bought my bike (DL1000 K2) last year with 10500km with 2 owners before. Therefore I never drove a new V-Strom…..
Now, after the modification, I am so happy – I can’t find words for!
I have never assumed that my bike can drive so smooth.
No shudder at all!
In idle (with pulled clutch) nearly no noise, like a 4 cylinder machine.
I can now use the full bandwidth from 2000rpm to the red area – no shudder at all!
Who said that you can’t ride a V-Strom between 2000 and 4000?
That is my favourite speed range in the city is now!!
If you have any shudder at your bike, I can only recommend that you send your bike to John for modification!
The only big problem, that I have now….. how do I get the grin out of my face?"
April 2010 Owner in Iowa
"Many thanks to John "Sharealike" for my new clutch basket! John's service has been super with a quick turn around and high quality workmanship.
It really has lived up to my expectation. Insanely smooth through low to high rpms and just perfect through the 2800-3500 range... No more "chudder" in that rpm range. Shifts smoother too. I'll post again after this season as I'm sure to put 12-15000 miles on it this year."
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April 2012 - Phoenix AZ
"John, just a quick note on my Vstrom, your handiwork has been been in by bike for 2 years/10k miles now, I reciently bought a low mile ST1100 (PanEuropean) but ended up selling it and keeping my Vstrom, as it runs out smoother-if you can believe that.. your mod made it possible to love the Vstrom (1K)... thanks again. Cheers, Paul- Phoenix, Arizona, USA".
April 2012 - Same owner in Iowa
"I now have over 15000 miles on my modified clutch basket with no changes
from the intitial improvement after installation. I pulled the right side
cover last year to have a look and it seemed perfect".
With 35 years of engineering background it was way back in 2008 that I set out to make a lasting durable fix for the chudder in my own bike and those of a few friends. Over 230 modifications now running in bikes all round the world. Exact same re-engineering of the internals still performed today as it was in 2010 for my first "customer".
John
West Yorkshire
vibefreevstrom@yahoo.com
0777 077 2456 - text or try later if no reply - probably out riding :auto-dirtbike:
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Congratulations, John - its something you must be proud of! :grin:
If I ever think about getting a Vee, the first thing I'll do is check you're still offering your mod before making a decision... :thumb:
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Reading this it is clear mine is suffering from "chudder".
I have been in touch with the dealer hopin they will fix it under the warranty that they offer when they sell bikes....
Either way I think this is the best option to repair the bike so if you are still doing these fixes please let me know.
Thanks
Richard
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Hello Richard
Thank you for your interest. Still doing the modifications here in Yorkshire. Most owners remove the basket themselves following a slide set I send out and post them here first class. Most are returned fist class within four days of arrival. Typical case for UK is post on Monday and you will have them back on the Friday or Saturday of the same week. Even quicker by arrangement to keep you on the road. Local folk are welcome to drop and collect in person.
All versions of basket, mileages/km's and conditions take the same time to modify. Cost varies a bit according to distance, country and condition. Welcome contact direct via email to John at vibefreevstrom@yahoo.com for a firm cost including post and timescales.
Check with me for a second diagnosis. Nothing worse than time, work and money spent to find it was something else, or never find what it was. Have also provided evidence encouraging dealers to honour their obligation under sale of goods or warranties in a few cases.
Sharealike
John
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Hi John, basket mod works a damn treat mate, did a trip over to Kronach in Germany around 1500 miles, plus a few more I did since being back, and it's all nice :) think it's about time Suzuki got their arse in gear and held their hands up to this factory fault... Many thanks again bud :)
Best regards
Garret in Oxford
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Thank you for your feedback Garret. Everyone comes back with their results without fail. Most direct via email and some even with a phone call. Probably less than five percent of owners running the modification who are registered to post here.
Recent response from an owner in Denmark. This is typical.
Hi John!
Clutchbasket arrived today. Man UK mail is fast!
I got it installed and went of on a test ride.
WOW is all I have to say - Bike is super smooth and chudder free!
Felt the different right when I pulled away.
So I would just like to thank you for perfect and extremely fast service, right from day one when I first contacted you :)
And for the price you take, it is simply amazing!
Best regards!
Now Chudder free
The modifications continue. More modifications this summer than last and it's picking up now we move into the closed season. Seems some of Europe has a low cost half year registration system.
John - AKA - Sharealike
West Yorkshire
0777 077 2456
01484 435084
vibefreevstrom@yahoo.com
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Hi, this is my first post so here goes.... I had John (sharalike)modify the clutch basket on my 66,000 mile k2 a few weeks ago. I can only join with the other happy owners who have had this mod' done. I commute daily on my Vee and am happy to say that I now have the bike I hoped it would be when I bought it aprox 6 months ago. After many years of riding BMW "brick and boxer" engined bikes, I thought that the "judder" was down to the v twin vibration... after researching the job on this and other sites, communication, advice and "how to" photos sent via email by John were spot on. I am glad to say that all is fantastic.. Have now completed close to 1000 miles on the modified clutch and am enjoying the improved and more comfortable ride of the Vee. Thanks John, glad to be one of your happy customers. I can only advise anyone who has this clutch issue to go for this modification... you won't regret it. Happy days! Andy. :clap:
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Keep receiving emails and PM's asking if I'm still modifying the clutch baskets. Looking here I realise my last activity was back in October 2012 so might explain peoples concerns. Yes I am still doing the mods. Expect to carry on through 2013.
Latest pictures of the modification.
Shown much of this before over the years and in all sorts of places so here's a complete set all in the same place.
From top left. Re-engineered basket and re-engineered gear.
Bottom row from left. Re-engineered inner and outer plates. New high tensile setscrews to replace old rivets.
All other components can often be used again after fine check for tolerance and signs of damage.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93959-1/1+parts+back+from+machine+shop.JPG)
New ground finish to hub of gear.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93961-1/2+Ground+finish.JPG)
Where the new sharealike bearing - precision machined to match will run. - example of original finish to right.
Old rivet holes are drilled, tapped and counter sunk for new high tensile setscrews. Some copiers have drilled these oversize and used thread inserts. This weakens the posts as the basket is very thin where the posts meet the main casting.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93963-1/3+sharealike+bearing.JPG)
Inner plate fitted to back of basket. Setting of exact position is done later after measurements.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93965-1/4+fit+inner+plate.JPG)
Gear and Spring Set fitted. Position of each spring is key.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93967-1/5+fit+gear+and+spring+set.JPG)
Dished Springs fitted. Look round the centre.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93969-1/6+fit+dished+springs.JPG)
Fit Top Cover. Original case hardening is roughed up to ensure underside of the setscrews key into the plate. This area is often polished on older baskets because the loose rivets allowed the surfaces to fret as they chuddered.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93971-1/7+fit+top+cover.JPG)
Insert and tighten three high tensile setscrews and oil pump gear drive dowel.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93973-1/8+fit+setscrews+and+oil+pump+drive+dowel.JPG)
Fit oil pump gear. The one thing that will only fit the right way round. Circlip can be fitted wrong.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93975-1/9+fit+drive+gear+and+circlip.JPG)
Look inside to check component positions ready for damping deflection checks.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93977-1/10+check+inside.JPG)
Measure damping deflection. Basket prevented from rotation while gear is rotated with increased loads.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93979-1/11+measure+damping+deflection.JPG)
Check the loading for each and observe the four phases of the torsion absorber working.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93981-1/12+check+and+observe+four+phases.JPG)
Strip after earlier test assembly. Adjust damping, deflection and phases based on measurements taken in above two stages.
Lubricate, rebuild, confirm adjutments are correct, seal to prevent moisture getting in and lubricant escape. Pack and ship back to owner.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/93983-1/13+strip+adjust+with+data+from+11+and+12+lubricate+rebuild+seal+ship.JPG)
This is by no means the complete process. Hope it gives some insight into the original sharealike re-engineered modification.
Only used approved engineering and widely accepted methods for the work. Pays much closer attention to position and tolerances of each component than when new. Please note the modification does not use shims in the springs like the bloke's in the US and Australia have tried. Shims just weaken the springs and you are back to square one with a basket that can't be repaired because you can't buy new springs. These dampers can now be opened up and re-adjusted after the initial modification shown above. They can then be regarded as serviceable item.
Started offering to modify them to save owners fitting serial replacement baskets. This mod seems to rid these lovely engines of the chudder for ever. Enjoyed helping everyone sort out their bikes.
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Thanks for the photo's, its really useful to see how these go together. Nice job too.
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Modern cars have similar dampers. Different location and parts but principle is the same as the torsion damper built into our clutch baskets.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfNjARZc ... re=related (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfNjARZc5Wo&feature=related)
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MfNjARZc5Wo&feature=related[/youtube]
Had plenty of interest from bike dealers lately. Road testing used bikes bought or traded in before sale or being prepared to go in their showrooms. Finding the noise at idle and vibration as they ride so sending clutch baskets here for the modification. Can only be good if it saves the new owners getting lumbered with the problem just after purchase. Check they know my name though. I also found a few knocking washers into the springs and welding bits on in dangerous places.
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Pictures that will help those with technical interest to understand the problem in more detail.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/91953-1/1a+Clutch+and+Crankshaft.jpg)
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/91955-1/2a+Primary+Drive+Gears.jpg)
This assembly weighs 10 Pounds or 4.5kg. It only needs the slightest encouragement from a failing torque damper to start it resonating at engine speeds of 3,000 to 4,000 rpm. The wear in the damper takes it "out of tune" so the resonance is felt throught the whole bike.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/91957-1/3a+Exploded+Clutch+Assembly.jpg)
Here's the Torque Damper. Does a fairly decent job when new but soon goes off and creates the vibrations that resonate through the bike.
(http://www.vstrom.info/vsri-gallery/gallery/d/91959-1/4a+Inside+the+Torque+Damper.jpg)
It's an excessive and jerky deflection of the damper at the critical engine/clutch rpm that causes the vibration. Had over three hundred of these open to date.
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A few owners reported similar symptoms to the 1000 engines chudder vibrations in their 650's.
I got hold of a 650 basket to strip and see if there were any similarities. Hoped to post pictures loaded to Dropbox but not working? Sorted it now. The rest will follow.
(https://photos-2.dropbox.com/t/0/AAD469ZE0fyl4HanDkrfGtAkWrOIowrhqpIqIqbKbdSGdQ/12/173738438/jpeg/32x32/3/_/1/2/DSC07928.JPG/QGt9eJ1JPtRuu3azhEZoADJoR7TOhn7BxOhInntAh_o?size=1024x768)
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Got mine back from John and fitted, the difference is amazing, I have the full rev range to play with now and the whole bike just seems smoother and in some ways more connected. MOT today then I can get used to a motorbike that is fun to ride and not one that tries to shake the skin off me.
Big thanks to John, highly recommended.
Cheers
Sharpy
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VStrom 1000 and SV1000 are not the only bikes suffering with problems in the clutch basket.
I put this together to explain. Seems to be a popular bike with those who moved on from the VStrom.
http://youtu.be/x9JUBJHTlQA (http://youtu.be/x9JUBJHTlQA)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9JUBJHTlQA
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Just had this mod done on my 2007 1k GT.
Literally makes it a different bike, much smoother, quieter, more rideable at speed due to the bike not shaking about so much.
The cost of this when weighed up against new exhaust, remap, etc is reasonable andhas made the biggest difference of any chang ever to my bike.
If you think you may want this done, and are in Kent, I will consider letting anyone have a little ride. Also my mechanic can install and service the bike and do throttle boddies for a really good price. I was shocked to pay less than 170 for all the work, and got. bike back that is like a new machine to me.
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I have to admit that I was a bit sceptical about this mod, but I have bitten the bullet and had it done.......
What a difference, amazing!! The bike is a different beast, smooth through the whole range, serious torque a proper big V twin!!
All I can say is money extremely well spent, if you do nothing else to the bike do this!! Many thanks to John for his work
Andrew, Oxfordshire
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Just had my basket from John abot 3 weeks ago. By far the best money I spent so far.
I was seriously considering getting rid of my bike in a few months time but after having the basket mod done ny John... NO WAY... Its totally transformed the bike, its soo smooth and quiet now. No more feathering the clutch all the time and no more juddering on take off. In the last 3 weeks I've done double the ammount of miles on the bike than the past 18 months. Love riding it now.
Cheers John. What a gent aswell.. :thumb:
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My K3 Strom had the dreaded chudder between 2700 - 4000 rpm.
I read about the Sharealike modification on here and another forum. I have to admit, I was a little dubious at first but bit the bullet and got my son in law to strip the bike down for me following the instructions here http://www.vibefreev.com/downloads/Clutch_Basket_Replacement_GB.pdf
It took him just about an hour so nothing too drastic. Posted the basket off on the Monday morning, and it was back with me fully modified by the Friday lunchtime.
I have got to say, the difference is noticeable immediately. Have only taken the bike on a short trip to try it out, but it feels so smooth now through the whole rev range.
John is an absolute gent to deal with, very helpful if you want something explained also.
This modification is worth every penny if yours has that awful vibration around that rev range.
Providing it's not pouring down, I'm off for a longer ride tomorrow.
Toj
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Happy New Year - I know its the 14th already but still 23/24ths of 2016 left.
Just a line to confirm that clutch basket modification work is still up and running here in the UK.
Thought it best as half the inquiries these days ask "are you still doing them?". YES and there is also news on the Idle Hammer damper for the crankshaft. And besides holiday and other matters I've had my head down prototyping. Been approached by owners of other bikes from four further manufacturers with wet clutch problems.
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Glad to hear you are still going strong and looking in other directions too. I've put 3k on my Vee and what a transformation, thanks for the fantastic job :)
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Hi John
Just bought a K6 Vee, which I now realise has the clutch vibration/chudder.
Now I'm only slightly mechanical minded, how easy a job is it to remove the clutch?
Hate to ask but how much is the repair?
Do you offer a ride in service :smirk:
Cheers
Ian
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A while since I visited this thread with any news so here we go.
I'm often asked by owners contemplating the clutch basket modification to supply or point them off to where they can buy the special clutch hub holding tool (CT021). And the rest of the recommended items for a top class remove and refit of the basket.
Here we are http://www.cjaccessories.co.uk/product.php?productid=18002&cat=0&page=1
Please note I'm not connected in any way with this business. I just asked if they could put a kit together at an all in one price to make it worth every ones while. I think its great. Parts are after market so to speak but I've used them all many times without a problem.
I'll pop back here to explain the importance of the four parts later.....
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Picture of the clutch basket modification changing kit. Four parts are new gasket for the clutch cover. New nut so you have a complete soft rim to knock a part into one spline to lock it. A replacement O section seal for the water pump cover. And most important of all the Clutch Hub Holding Tool.
The Gasket - Important any gasket used has these rings of extra soft sealing material in tact. These seal the two water passages that pass from front and rear cylinder water jackets to the water pump. If they leak you will slowly move cooling water to your oil. Not good for engine longevity.
The Nut - Bikes that have been through a few stock clutch baskets before fitting the modifed upgrade could have a well used nut. Suzuki recommend new every time. At least with this you will be confident of a new soft rim to tap into the splines to lock it after tightening.
'O' section water seal - This seal fits inside a groove in the water pump cover. The cover has to be removed or at least loosened before removing the main clutch cover. The front of the cover traps road salt and fine particles of grit as its in direct line with what's thrown up by the front wheel. Over the years this swells as it corrodes a little of the aluminium of the sealing faces and pushes the seal out of shape. Cleaning out the groove while the cover is off and using a new seal before re filling the cooling sysytem is the best way to be certain of a water tight engine long term.
And last but not least the Clutch Hub Holding Tool. Called a CT 021 by EBC. This locks the hub of the clutch correctly as Suzuki recommends while both undoing and then re torquing the main nut on the gearbox shaft. This is the only way to hold it firm and stable while the correct torque is used to ensure the nut does not come loose over time after fitting the modified clutch basket.
Its the splines in the middle that lock onto the hub. Note it also has tangs round the outside which engage with the clutch basket. They are useful to steady the tool and keep it square while working. The tool can also be used to test the clutch basket damper. Use it to turn the basket in both back and forth directions before its removed from its mesh with the primary drive gear. The free movement and noise as the damper is flexed in each direction is what the clutch basket modification is designed to address.
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Just as the first Suzuki VStrom 1000's will be passing their fifteenth birthdays, and the Suzuki SV1000 their fourteenths, I'm reminded just how old some of the bikes are. They are lasting very well and if the level of clutch basket modifications I'm performing is any indication, both bikes using this engine are getting more use than ever.
I'm often asked about the clutch holding tool and new gasket for the clutch cover. Both essential to making a good job, I can send these out with modified basket but the tool is needed to remove the basket besides refitting it once it returns from modification/upgrade/rebuild. Better perhaps that the tool and all additional parts which might be required can be ordered up front. I made contact with a local Suzuki aftermarket parts supplier CJ Accessories who are happy to stock and send out the items. Now as the bikes get older and many are on their second (even third) stock clutch basket, I'm expecting the main nut for the clutch hub and the seal for the water pump cover could be needed more often when changing out the clutch basket. Link below to the full four part kit..
http://www.cjaccessories.co.uk/product.php?productid=18002&cat=0&page=1
Search the site as due to demand they now offer part of the kit such as without the clutch hub holding tool. Another sign perhaps that owners have a tool from a previous change of clutch basket. http://www.cjaccessories.co.uk/product.php?productid=18028&cat=0&page=1
And for the nearly new bikes. Just the above tool required and perhaps stay with a genuine Suzuki gasket if changing a basket while a bike is still under warranty. I've not checked the after market gaskets in these kits against genuine to confirm if its good for the 2014 and on engines. More to come later about clutch noise, vibration and crank idle hammer in the later 2014 onward ABS Vstrom 1000 engines.
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Suzuki VStrom 2016 build clutch basket/engine vibration at only 800 miles (1200km).
Pictures below of a June 2016 made standard Suzuki clutch basket sent here for re engineering. This basket is taken from a 2014 build year bike so not its original.
Owner in a hilly part of the USA writes there is vibration while riding from 2,700 to 3,500 rpm and sometimes above this in most gears.
First pic confirms made (casting was cast) in 2016. Letter F is June.
Second pic - turned over shows later more robust design DL1000 basket cover plate.
Third with cover removed to show gear - springs taken out. Bearing face on gear shown top of pic.
Fourth with gear lifted out to inspect the usual problem bearing inside.
Fifth shows black smears running away from point of wear.
Last two pics showing more detail of the wear.
In the direction of wear I could feel at least 0.5mm play in this bearing. This let the casting knock about on the hub of the gear. Bikes with the chudder have this rattling at the specific engine rpm. The black smears are a not at all nice abrasive compound of worn aluminium and oil. Fact the owner caught this basket so young lets us pinpoint where the wear starts. Higher mileage baskets have smears all round or some oils appear to have washed all or most traces away.
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Just a reminder to pack baskets well before shipping them over.
I always imagine the shipping company is going to throw them the length of a van - but the bloke doing the catching is going to miss it.
Over the years have found the most easily available packing is a strong box made of cardboard. Then corrugated cardboard wrapped round the outside of the basket to fill the gaps. Then a middle column of corrugated cardboard to space the delicate fingers clear of the box lid.
Much like this -
The weight when packed is often no more than 3kg. The largest box you might need is 30cm by 30cm by 20cm tall.
(weight of the clutch basket is only 2.2kg - actual size is 20cm diameter by 10cm tall)